Thursday, July 20, 2006

Where are the Christians?
By Pat Buchanan

But where are the Christians? Why is Pope Benedict virtually alone among Christian leaders to have spoken out against what is being done to Lebanese Christians and Muslims?

When al-Qaida captured two U.S. soldiers and barbarically butchered them, the U.S. Army did not smash power plants across the Sunni Triangle. Why then is Bush not only silent but openly supportive when Israelis do this? (snip)

Already, Bush is ranting about Syria being behind the Hezbollah capture of the Israeli soldiers. But where is the proof?

Who is whispering in his ear? The same people who told him Iraq was maybe months away from an atom bomb, that an invasion would be a "cakewalk," that he would be Churchill, that U.S. troops would be greeted with candy and flowers, that democracy would break out across the region, that Palestinians and Israelis would then sit down and make peace?

How much must America pay for the education of this man?

'Hardball with Chris Matthews' for July 19

MATTHEWS: Great, thank you very much. Please keep coming back, Andrew Lee Butters in Beirut.

Let‘s bring in now two political analysts, Pat Buchanan and of course Bob Shrum, both with us regularly. Pat, let‘s go through the politics of this situation. The neocons are out there complaining that this president isn‘t tough enough. I have no idea what they mean, 50,000 dead in Iraq, it was supposed to be a cake walk. Ken Edelman‘s out there today saying we should go other places, you have got guys who have wanted to blow up every Arab country on their list. Why is going on in their complaint and why does the president pays five seconds attention to them?

PAT BUCHANAN, MSNBC POLITICAL ANALYST: I don‘t know why he pays attention to them, Chris. What they want, Chris, is a wider war, especially in the Middle East. They want the United States to fight Israel‘s war against Hezbollah, Syria but especially Iran.

And the Israelis want us to fight Iran‘s well. But it‘s not in the interest of the United States. None of those countries, even Hezbollah and Hamas have not attacked the United States of America. I don‘t think the country is listening to the neocons anymore. I think they‘re discredited. The question is, is Bush listening to them, because he was gone for awhile up through his second inaugural, very much according to a script they wrote.

MATTHEWS: Literally.



MATTHEWS: I just wonder Pat about the simple history. We know from looking at the Arab world, as we‘ve come to understand it, that there‘s this division between the Shia, who are on the outs and they‘re coming to be the ins of course in Iraq and they‘re certainly already in control of Iran, taking on Sunnis, that‘s a war we‘re only vaguely understanding. That‘s a 1,000-year-old war. Do you think we‘re creating another 1,000 year war by killing so many Arabs? I‘ve been afraid of this war from day one, because I‘ve always felt, based on history, every time you somebody, you‘ve got his brother, his mother, his family coming back to get you. We‘ve killed 50,000 Iraqis in a war that was supposed to be a two-day wonder.

When are we going to notice that the neocons don‘t know what they‘re talking about? They‘re not looking at this country‘s long-term interests. They‘re bound up in regional and global ideology and they have had no experience, I‘ll say it again, in even a school yard fight. They don‘t know what physical fighting is all about. They went to school and were intellectuals, but they he want our government to be their big brother. I don‘t get it. I don‘t know why we keep falling for it and the president, you say is he free of these guys yet or not?

BUCHANAN: Well, the president fell for it after 9-11 when they put their little precooked meal in front of him after he knocked down Afghanistan and so they said let‘s do Iraq now and Wolfowitz and all the rest of them. But let me say this Chris, I think the president realizes now that we went into Iraq to pursue weapons that did not exist, a country that did not attack us, did not threaten us, and now we have created a great base camp for terrorism in the Anbar province, the west there, that did not exist.

In response to Mr. Shrum, not only the 150,000 hostages, you attack Iran, Hezbollah will retaliate against the 25,000 Americans in Lebanon, you will have massive hostage takings and killings. Are these people nuts? You‘ve got to ask yourself. I certainly hope the president is not listening to them, because I really question whether they‘ve got America‘s national interest at heart. They are calling for wars against people that never attacked us. I don‘t care how bad they are. There are wicked people all over this world, but you don‘t go after people unless they come after you.

Analysis- Pat Buchanan has it right not only about the silent religious leaders but he is thinking of what is good for the U.S. All I can say is to repeat Pat's question where are the Christians? People are suffering and dying yet I here nothing but Israel good Arab bad. Who is trying to stop the killing? Sitting back and pointing fingers is easy but changes nothing.

Holy War
As the Middle East burns, GOP pols, neocon pundits, and a powerful Christian right leader all sing the same (crazy) tune.
In the June issue of the Prospect, I wrote about Texas televangelist John Hagee, an Armageddon prophesier who insists that military confrontation with Iran is foretold in the Bible as a necessary precondition for the Second Coming.

This is not my religion. This is a religion that has been hijacked for political purposes and I wan't my religion back. A religion of peace.


Blogger Fool 4 You, Baby said...

I have abstained from posting here because this blog is NOT the Roseville Conservative I know.

However, I believe that everyone here should go read this post at this blog site for a different and perhaps better perspective why Israel has reacted thusly with the states that harbor and allow terrorists to opperate within their borders.

11:05 AM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

Fool, I knew you were lurking out there somewhere. Just laying low and waiting. By the way, where were you all of last week before Aaron closed his version of Roseville Conservative down? That seemed kind of strange in an ominous sort of way.

All that said, it seems that you have gone rather far afield for your sourcing here. You go to a blog site that has won the 2004 and 2005 Jewish and Israeli blog site award. Why would you be going there to get your talking points? What is your intersection of interest?

To repeat myself, you seem to be going rather far afield for a guy who lives just down the road from me...

11:24 AM  
Blogger Fool 4 You, Baby said...

The blogger of mention is a former [American] Naval serviceman whose exceptionally pertinent allegory communicates precisely why the world should allow Israel continue its course.

The very real, very ugly reality is that the state of affairs between the state of Israel and its terrorist harboring and perpetrating neighbors will not stop until the terrorists and their sponsors cry out in bloody agony, “I GIVE”.

2:43 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

But,Fool, you touch none of my questions. Not that I expected you to.

Neoconia went subterranean when Wolfowitz cut and ran for the good life and cushy job at the World Bank. The Prince of Darkness has kept a relatively low profile. He keeps his hand in via Hollinger International, the Jerusalem Post, and the American Enterprise Institute. Neoconia has relied heavily on folks like you and Aaron to keep them from fading into total oblivion.

Not a bad arrangement. You and Aaron get the scraps the fall off the table while they live the high life which they are accustomed to. They laugh at you all the way to bank. They leave you with dreams of the End Times in your time dancing in your head...

What a deal...

4:12 PM  
Blogger Fool 4 You, Baby said...

PS - I will likely not post here much longer. I started posting as a favor to a friend. My friend no is no longer the proprietor of this blog and my time is scarce so I will likely further cut back posting.

However, I will touch on, first, the questions you say I have evaded then, second, your latest post.

PS said, “ seems that you have gone rather far afield for your sourcing here. You go to a blog site that has won the 2004 and 2005 Jewish and Israeli blog site award. Why would you be going there to get your talking points? What is your intersection of interest?”

Far afield? Not really. I thought his commentary was profoundly insightful.
Talking points? Not sure where you read talking points in my post.
Intersection of interest? Perhaps the only relevant question you asked. I am imminently interested in the destruction of terrorist organizations that inflict death, destruction, and fear while feigning victimhood.

I wonder whether you actually read the blog post or were just immediately alarmed that the blog post you were potentially going to read was written by someone from Israel. No problem, I’m sure he gets that reaction quite a bit.

But,Fool, you touch none of my questions. Not that I expected you to.

Really? I suppose if you read Mr. Bogner’s commentary, your head might have exploded from overdose of common sense. I guess what I am getting at is that I could tell that you didn’t read the post because you didn’t react to it.

”Neoconia went subterranean when Wolfowitz cut and ran for the good life and cushy job at the World Bank. The Prince of Darkness has kept a relatively low profile. He keeps his hand in via Hollinger International, the Jerusalem Post, and the American Enterprise Institute. Neoconia has relied heavily on folks like you and Aaron to keep them from fading into total oblivion.”

Are you afraid of Jewish people, PS?

Just go read the blog.

6:00 PM  
Blogger Lucy Stern said...

I went and read it Fool and I agree with the assessment. TF has said all along that it will take an all out war to end this. The Muslims never seem to stand up to any deal they make. I think Isreal has been very patient and I don't blame them for wanting to get this over with.

I don't think I will be reading this blog much longer either. Hope you guys have fun duking it out.

7:34 PM  
Blogger Lucy Stern said...

Before I go completely: Let's just back to the original post. You want to know what has happened to religion? Read this:

"Heavenly Father, we come before you today to ask your forgiveness
and to seek your direction and guidance."

"We know Your Word says, "Woe to those who call
evil good," but that is exactly what we have done.
We have lost our spiritual equilibrium and reversed our values.
We have exploited the poor and called it the lottery.
We have rewarded laziness and called it welfare.
We have killed our unborn and called it choice.
We have shot abortionists and called it justifiable.
We have neglected to discipline our children and called it building self
We have abused power and called it politics.
We have coveted our neighbor's possessions and called it ambition.
We have polluted the air with profanity and pornography and called it freedom
of _expression.
We have ridiculed the time-honored values of our forefathers and called
it enlightenment.
Search us, Oh God, and know our hearts today; cleanse us from every sin
and Set us free.
Commentator Paul Harvey aired this prayer on his radio program, "The
Rest of the Story," and received a larger response to this program
than any other he has ever aired. With the Lord's help, may this prayer
sweep over our nation and wholeheartedly become our desire so that we again
can be called "One nation under God."

7:39 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

Fool, I knew before I commented that you would trot out the "are you afraid of Jewish people" card. I would have bet every thing that I own and every thing that I could borrow.

Little do you know about me. That is the way it will be. You know virtually nothing about who in real life have been formational for me. You know nothing of who has befriended me over the years. You know nothing about who in their written works have had profound influence on me.

But go ahead and take your predictable cheap shots at me. That is the essential signiture of your grasp of the world...

8:09 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

The title of this post is

Where are the Christians?

Ordinary Christians quietly get in touch with their tender circle of those who do the faith walk with them.

This received from a friend who shares membership in our weekly men's spiritual formation group and Brotherhood of St. Andrew.

Subject: Prayer request
A good friend of mine, Walid, is from Lebonon. He and his wife Jinan and their three children are living in Lebonon. I have not been able to reach him and find myself looking for them in news clips of desperate refugees streaming into Syria and onto ships.

Please pray for their safety and all the innocents caught up in this tragic conflict.

Grace and peace

R. represents a silent Christian majority. Too long our faith walk has been trampled on by noisey louts who mistakenly call themselves Christians. But they expose themselves for what they are, especially in times such as this...

8:43 PM  
Blogger Russ said...

All very predictable. Only one person gets it. PS I had faith that you would see it I also did not expect any others to agree with Buchanan.

There are two reasons for this.
One is the thinking that Lucy and TF have that there MUST be an all out war to end this strangely the same thinking that Texas televangelist John Hagee, an Armageddon prophesier who insists that military confrontation with Iran is foretold in the Bible as a necessary precondition for the Second Coming.
Lucy -The Muslims never seem to stand up to any deal they make
That thinking makes it easier to condone.

Two is Fools throw out
Are you afraid of Jewish people, PS?
that you must be anti Jewish if if you disagree with Israels collective punishment.

I knew this post would be the end for most, the truth is sometimes to painful. I understand.

It is easier to look the other way and believe that man can bring about the second coming. All man can do is destroy each other.
The total hijacking is further along than I thought.

Muslim extremist and Christian extremists and none of them see themselves as extremists.

PS I pray they will be safe.

9:37 PM  
Blogger Stalin the Shark said...

Speaking of Israel, here's written by an Israeli journalist in Tel Aviv. Inter alia, it details the ongoing conversations, via blogs, chat rooms and IMs, between Israeli and Lebanese civilians; I think that's a historical first, where citizens of combatants have exchanges in real time.

Personally, I have no problem with the complete destruction of Hezbollah. What concerns me is Lebanon, which is the first and only Arab democracy. It does not serve our national interest to stand by as that country is pounded into rubble.

That national interest is not identical with that of the State of Israel, and is anti-thetical to the bloodlust engendered by our right wing. As to the inevitable rejoinder "you don't support Israel, so you must not like Jews", first, as a New Yorker, I'm an honorary Jew, complete with Passover Seders/synagogues/bar mitzvahs/shivas I've gone to (and most people here probably haven't), second, because I believe that the collateral damage Israel is inflicting on its main natural ally in the Mideast is to be deplored. Lebanon is the freest, most advanced country in the region, with a non-Muslim/non-Sunni majority; what's going on now is a tragedy.

But of course, let's not look at details while there is death and destruction to celebrate. It's the winger way.

10:54 AM  
Blogger Russ said...

While I still think this post will effectively end this blog (OK since RC's shoes are to big to fill) STS we agree the destruction of Hezbollah would be a good thing (glad more than one person gets the rest of it).

The problem with Israels collective punishment is Hezbollah has the hospitals, schools and other social programs that help the people live day to day. Things the Lebanese Gov. does not or Can not do.

Hezbollah was created to fight the Israeli occupation in the early 80's. More occupation will not make them go away it will only strenthen support for them. Only a political process to marginalize them will work.

Do they think you can turn a population against and organization that literally gives them food, water and Education by bombing civilian infrastructure.

You can't and in the meantime more innocent people die.

So what is the real reason behind this? A play on Iran?

12:52 PM  
Blogger PB said...

RPG--Do not let this be the end of the blog. I for one am glad to read such refreshing and insightful writing. While the flame thrower approach drew folks here, it was to do battle. This site will now draw people here to reason. Do not get me wrong, I enjoy cutting sarcasm, but balance is good, and I enjoy sarcasm as sarcasm, not truth.

Lucy--Don't pack your bags, I've always enjoy your posts and value your opinion here, as do others. We often disagree, but you are grounded and not a parrot of the talking points.

2:19 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

Russ, there is no compelling reason to wind down this blogspot.

Political conservatism has a time honored tradition. Political extremists hijacked the name Conservative as brazenly as they did Christian.

You bring a breath of fresh air and beacon of honesty to the conservative cause...

4:33 PM  
Blogger P said...

Israel is smashing Lebanon/Hezbollah because after they pulled out of Gaza and dismantled and threw their own people from their homes in the settlements, the Israeli government vowed to use "overwhelming" force if it others viewed the pullout as an act of weakness, and, began to attack Israel. They are in their full right to defend their country from forces that want to "push them into the sea." Hopefully Israel keeps going and kills many Hezbollah, then hits Syria.

5:35 PM  
Blogger P said...

As for "religion" of peace, read the bible. God isn't peaceful when He's angry. He tends to kill lots of people, cause nations to be overthrown, and sends lot of natural disasters. But, I admit, I don't like the pseudo-christians in government or other groups trying to tell us that they are doing what God wants, lol. It's pretty laughable. I doubt if there are more than a handful of people of real faith in Washington. The faith that says, sicked people still get healed miraculously, God is still active on Earth, and those of the true faith are led by and obey the leading of the Holy Spirit. Won't find that in any religion, lol.

5:44 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

P, I'm not a military and anti-terrorism specialist such as you. I did my bit in the early 60's in Germany as a crew chief in charge of a large stash of rocket motors on which nuke warheads were to be launched if the Ruskies got adventuresome.

Given my limited background and your extensive background, I am just wondering. How are the Hezzies going to push the Israeli back in the sea? The Israelis have quite an airforce. They have quite a range of armored, airborne,infantry, and special forces units. They have quite a range of ordnance including nukes.

How, pray tell, are the Hezzies going to push the Israelis back into the sea? That seems in my inferior judgement, to be a bit of war hysteria rhetoric...

6:01 PM  
Blogger P said...

PS, Hezbollah will never "push" Israel into the sea. Although, Iran and Syria supply Hezbollah with ordinance and intel, and, Iran specifically has said they want Israel to disappear from the Earth. Hezbollah is merely an arm of Iran and Syria. Thus, one may conclude that Israel is fighting Iran's proxy, thus, Iran itself. With all of your military "expertise," are you one to do things half-ass PS? Israel is surrounded by enemies, they have had to fight off offenders countless times, something we in modern America have never experienced. So, we are in a place to judge them for what they do to survive? Repeating the same thing over and over again expecting a different result is insanity. If Israel has shown restraint in the past and it hasn't worked, why keep showing restraint against the people who want to kill them?
With all of your military "expertise" PS, why isn't Israel following your advice, with all of their "expertise" in surviving in an environment surrounded by enemies?

8:12 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

Hey,P, I put my disclaimer right up front. I have no military or counter-terrorism expertise.

Bush is da Man when it comes to that field of endeavor. Albeit with a little help from last throes Cheney...

8:38 PM  
Blogger P said...

PS, your disclaimer sounded a bit sarcastic, lol, and, you KNOW that I've never been in the military where as you have, lol. Perhaps a little condescending? ;)

8:55 PM  
Blogger Russ said...

P-Repeating the same thing over and over again expecting a different result is insanity

Since collective punishment has proven itself useless as a tactic in the middle east why is Israel doing it again in Lebanon. A democracy that was building itself as a tourist destination. Israel has set Lebanon back a decade or more to rebuild it's infrastructure. It is obvious they do not care about Hearts and minds.
Downing Street said the prime minister would stand by Mr Howell's comments, adding the British government had "always urged restraint on Israel".
Speaking in Beirut, Mr Howells said: "I very much hope that the Americans understand what's happening to Lebanon.

"The destruction of the infrastructure, the death of so many children and so many people. These have not been surgical strikes.

"And it's very difficult, I think, to understand the kind of military tactics that have been used.

P-Hezbollah is merely an arm of Iran and Syria. Thus, one may conclude that Israel is fighting Iran's proxy, thus, Iran itself.

Or is Israel just our proxy?

9:15 PM  
Blogger Russ said...

here's the link
Or is Israel just our proxy?

9:18 PM  
Blogger P said...

Sorry Russ. The Lebanese government could have chosen to take on Hezbollah. They didn't, thus, we are where we are at. Israel is taking care of them.

Who would you rather have as our Proxy? Iran, Syria, Hamas, Hezbollah? I'll go with Israel everytime. They are surrounded by people who want them eliminated, and, some of who call America "the great Satan." They are surrounded by people who danced when planes hit the twin towers, and, who regularly behead and torture their captives. They are surrounded by the insane who think they will get 77 virgins for killing themselves, and, innocent people in the process.
Innocent people are dying in Lebanon, but, Israel did not invade without provocation, quite the contrary. The day any of us experience what the Israeli's have experienced in enduring attacks and wars on their citizens is the day we will be fit to judge them, until then, all arguments against them are moot.

10:01 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

Way up at the top of this thread, Fool enters with a haughty...

I have abstained from posting here because this blog is NOT the Roseville Conservative I know.

Then he flounced off when we unwashed ruffians do what unwashed ruffians a little too rough

I woulda liked for him to have hung around awhile, especially to see what he would have to say about this...

It seems that the Head Rapturist, Timmy LaHaye has a bit of anti-semitic streak in him. He called the Israelis, Not to be trusted Yids.

Am I surprised, well sorta. But then again, I have seen time and time again the haughty, demanding, grandiose sense of entitlement of the Christian Zionists.

Delay of gratification is not their schtick...

1:23 PM  
Blogger Russ said...

I would like to thank those of you want the blog to continue, it was a nice and unexpected surprise. I really thought this post would be to much for everyone. I am very happy to be wrong.

P- the Lebanese Government is to weak to disarm Hezbollah, a group that had more power and influence with the people than the government because they feed people give them medical care and an education.

I think everyone agrees the Hezzies (thanks PS) should be disarmed who would object to disarming militant terrorists?
That is not what I object to. I object to bombing civilians and making civilians suffer while Israel implements a plan they have had for over a year.

The British split with Bush as Israeli tanks roll in. Britain dramatically broke ranks with George Bush last night over the Lebanon crisis, publicly criticising Israel's military tactics and urging America to 'understand' the price being paid by ordinary Lebanese civilians.

absolute determination to deal with Hezbollah and to see that the UN resolutions requiring it to be disarmed are finally carried through'

The British get it why is it so difficult for Bush?

Speaking of UN resolutions how many Resolutions has Israel NOT complied with?(link from STS comment Section.)

Israel and Hezbollah trade fire as Syria issues warning
made hundreds of thousands refugees in their own country and destroyed billions of dollars of infrastructure.
.He said the current offensive would not match the magnitude of the 1982 invasion, which left about 20,000 people dead, traumatising Lebanon and plunging Israel also into a lethal quagmire

So it wont be that bad? Just a three week war. For?

Before The U.S. backs widening the war lets elect leaders who know how to lead. This "new war" certainly takes attention from all other Bush failures in the mid east.

The question for me is "Does Bush believe Armageddon starts with a war in Iran?" and Is Bush trying to make it happen?

PS-Hagee changes the scripture to make it more appealing for Jewish people. He says they do not have to convert. Unbelievable.

Dubose and Jan Reid point out that Hagee seems to have switched up on the Jews-will-convert-or-perish part of his vision -- a concept that many Jews find particularly troubling, and managed to finesse the issue so Jews don't wind up getting Left Behind:

[Hagee] cuts Jews in on Christian salvation. His theology includes a loophole for Jews, or to borrow a phrase from Liberation Theology, "a preferential option" for the Jews.

PB thanks for my new moniker RPG :)

4:48 PM  
Blogger P said...

Russ. Yes, the Lebanese army is too weak to disarm Hezbollah, so, the question becomes, "who should do it?" The U.N.? Lol, when pigs can fly perhaps, lol. They have had 2000 peacekeepers there for years, and, look what they got. NATO, yes, I would go for a NATO force, but, would they actually fight Hezbollah? I like the idea Israel is floating. "We will take on Hezbollah until their forces are diminished enough for the Leb. Army to deal with them, along with a NATO peace force in Southern Leb." Another way, tell Syria and Iran to halt all support of Hezbollah immediately. If they don't, slap heavy U.N. sanctions on them. I doubt that would work though, seeing what we have from the U.N. ie. Oil for Food (worked great!) 0_0

I'm not a big Bush fan at all, but, taking out Iran's nuke facilities is a must. No invasion... bomb them (the nuke sites), nuke them, then send in spec. forces to make sure the stuff can't be brought back on line for 20 years. Iran is lying to us and the world, the day they get nukes, they can reak havoc in the ME, especially on Israel, and they know this, thus the stall tactics.

8:41 PM  
Blogger Prodigal Son said...

William F Buckley, Jr. is the Father of modern American Conservatism. I some times wonder if the current hodgepodge of Christian Zionists, Dispensationalists, neocons, and just plain cons, grifters, and grafters who have attached themselves to George W Bush in a symbiotic relationship know who he is.

Mr. Buckley was recently interviewed regarding his views about George W Bush’s presidency.. He deems Bush not to be a true Conservative. (and by extension, all the above named hangers on ).

Here some of the more pithy excerpts delivered in Mr. Buckley’s inimitable way.

In particular, Buckley views the three-and-a-half-year Iraq War as a failure.

"If you had a European prime minister who experienced what we've experienced it would be expected that he would retire or resign," Buckley says.

Buckley rejects neo-conservatives who favor a more interventionist foreign policy, including a pre-emptive air strike against Iran and its nuclear facilities.

"If we find there is a warhead there that is poised, the range of it is tested, then we have no alternative. But pending that, we have to ask ourselves, 'What would the Iranian population do?'"

"I think Mr. Bush faces a singular problem best defined, I think, as the absence of effective conservative ideology — with the result that he ended up being very extravagant in domestic spending, extremely tolerant of excesses by Congress," Buckley says. "And in respect of foreign policy, incapable of bringing together such forces as apparently were necessary to conclude the Iraq challenge."

Asked what President Bush's foreign policy legacy will be to his successor, Buckley says "There will be no legacy for Mr. Bush. I don't believe his successor would re-enunciate the words he used in his second inaugural address because they were too ambitious. So therefore I think his legacy is indecipherable"

On Mr. Conservative's words, I rest my case. George Bush and his coterie of hangers on are sham conservatives

5:21 AM  
Blogger Russ said...

Buckley is right Bush is no conservative fiscal or otherwise.

John Hagee, pastor of Cornerstone Church in San Antonio and founder and national chairman of Christians United for Israel (CUFI), said this is not a time for Christians to be silent because of "the growing, active aggression we're seeing toward Israel and its people," along with the "growing threat toward any nation that supports Israel."

CUFI leaders acknowledged a hesitance by Jews to accept evangelical Christians' support.

"I will rebuke the State Department for any and every time it told Israel to stand down and show restraint," Mr. Falwell said.

Why would Jews be hesitant to accept evangelical Christians' support? Just because these so called Christians have an agenda to use Israel to bring about the end of times or the fact that they change what the Bible says to make it more palatable.

Fundamentalists of any religion are dangerous.

How can anyone that professes to follow Christ support the killing of innocent men, woman and children?

8:01 AM  
Blogger Russ said...

When you look at it this way -

Jerry Falwell You are this week’s winner for having said that you will chastize the state department if it ever told Israel to slack up on the killing. Hell forbid a conservative Christian ever preaching Jesus’ message of peace, love and brotherhood. Keep on preaching an anti-Christ message in the name of Jesus. You know it well, Jerry Falwell. Damn the peacemakers. Screw the poor. Shit on those who mourn now for they are going to be whining like losers tomorrow. Blessed are those who feast now, for they have been chosen by God to have dominion over the world. Blessed are those who make wars, for they know how to get what God wants them to have. Blessed are those who curse and hate their enemies, and care only for those of the same creed and race. After all, what good is it to have a soul if you cannot gain the world? The love of money is the root of all pleasure and success.

8:15 AM  
Blogger LNaranjoiv said...

LOLOL......oh my, this guy's a hoot......disarm hezbullah??
Blame Israel? Oh, poor civilians?
Hold up, infrastructure destroyed?

Geeeeeesh........I thought RC was a woos to abandon the FOOL has an excuse....Lucy's quitting......why?

Cause this site's gone, Lefty???
Pfffffftttttttt....This tom foolio is funnier than stalin on a bad day. " Let us, have discussions, with hezbullah, cause it's the ONLY WAY! "
Ah......yea, whatever.

While you're bemoaning UN resolutions the ISRAELI"s have failed to follow, what has Lebanon failed to do? Who promised to remove them from Southern Lebanon?
And, this weekend, the Lebanese say they'll help DEFEND hezbullah against the Israelis?? AHAHAHAHA
Those idiot can't disarm a ragtag group of whacko's, what do they think they can do to a modern army?
And, if they believe then CAN take on Israel, why aren't they then disarming Hezbullah?? Sounds to me, like they WANT them there.....
Nah, that's contrary to things coming out of the country.

Speaking many of those ( Supposed ) US citizens are duel citizens?? Hmmmmm........personally, I say, make a choice as to WHICH country you wish to belong too.

Then again, if it were ME.....there'd be over 25000 foreigners hostage, at least 3-4 cruise ships burning or sunk, scores of civilians would've been executed, beginning with the Europeans, cause they'll buckle first.....then the Americans...cause they seem to be bucking up lately.

That action of course, is if it were ME in charge of Hezbullah.
I'm not........But don't believe for a moment those TOURISTS are alive cause they WERE'NT threatened already.

ah well, the lefty blog site rolls on.....this should be entertaining.

9:08 AM  
Blogger LNaranjoiv said...

WHile I'm on a tear, I wonder...
Since this fake RC poster person brought it up....what innocents?
Women, men, children? Hmmmm.....and you only blame the Israelis?? Ahahahaha...typical lefty.

Never accured to you, that the terrorists are USING those very people to save themselves? Never accured to you, that those people CAN"T leave? Hmm, hiding munitions inside of Hospitals, mosques, private homes.....why, that CAN"T be their fault, can it? Nah, you'd rather blame Israel.

Well, the Lebanese want their nation back, time to fight for it, and toss Hezbullah AND the syrians out.

In war, there are casualties....Hmmm, isn't that an interesting comment....innocents dying. I wonder how many ' innocent ' civilians perrished in WW2?
Then again, out of the 56 million casualties from WW2, how many were innocent?

Ah well, for this person, the history lesson is lost.....typical.

9:11 AM  
Blogger Russ said...

LN - I am glad I could give you a laugh. Anyway to your post.

Blame Israel? Oh, poor civilians?
Hold up, infrastructure destroyed?

Yes poor civilians, billions in damaged infrastructure and who suffers? Who bombed the infrastructure?

The point of the post was that people calling themselves followers of Christ can overlook the very things Christ taught. And for what?

12:05 PM  
Blogger LNaranjoiv said...

So Russ, or whatever you choose to be named, what is it that people who claim to be followers of christ, forgot in their teachings?

Nice shift away, not an answes tho...

But, I'm all for your bible thumping to commence......I always loved a good sermon......

3:26 PM  
Blogger HD said...

There seems to be a great deal of glee over the prospect of Armageddon being just around the corner, if we can only just push that final button to get it started. People who think that encouring the end of mankind will somehow hasten their walk with god are fools. Christianity is supposed to teach that life is precious (look at all those anti-abortionists)and not something to encourage the end of. I consider people who who would end life early to go to heaven to be no better that a bunch of lemmings.

Open war between Israel and the Palestinians may well bring on the end of life on this planet. It is not something to be glad about, it is something to avoid. If people in this country are smart, and it appears they aren't, they'll start demanding the impeachment of Bush Jr.... and they'll do it now.

4:57 PM  
Blogger Russ said...

LN what is it that people who claim to be followers of christ, forgot in their teachings?
But, I'm all for your bible thumping to commence

If you want a sermon go to Church.

If you have no clue what Christ was about I encourage you to find out if not that is fine to your choice.

I may be wrong but I think he thought killing was wrong but maybe you know more about him. If so let me know.

HD- I do not like to judge others but people that are hoping for a nuclear war with Iran to bring the second coming of Christ seem to have a cult mentality that is disturbing to me.

5:19 PM  
Blogger LNaranjoiv said...

No need to do the church thing, I can jerk your chain and get just what I asked for right here.....( view other post as to your retort )

I have a clue about what JESUS is/was about........tho you keep to saying CHRIST and CHRISTIANS.....interesting.
he may HAVE thought killing was wrong, tho he sure did his fair share of it, or so say the scriptures.

God may be merciful, but then again, he does have his moments.

You are however, showing your true colors more and more tho...just like I said would happen.

Oh, DOOOOOOOOO continue........

6:17 PM  
Blogger HD said...

Russ comments were suggsting there are people with that mentality who are praying and pushing for Armageddon; it was a statement of belief on my part, not passing judgement. I suspect Armageddon is predestined, and will happen when it happens. No sooner, no later. I just happen to think we were put on this earth to learn and grow, to enjoy or lives, and the lives others around us. Not to run head first into death. It makes no sense, in any terms, in particular, religious terms.

7:35 PM  
Blogger Russ said...

HD- I could not agree more. I should have just said that

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